SMNnews Forums  


Go Back   SMNnews Forums > General Forums > Musician Central

Musician Central music theory and gear discussion


Get Metallica T-Shirts & Merch from Rock.com


Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 08-29-2011, 07:47 PM   #1
Necrovore
Kyphonism
 
Necrovore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Davis, CA
Posts: 764
Rep Power: 11 Necrovore is on a distinguished road
Vader cab thoughts/questions

I've been looking at getting a 4x12 cab upgrade and, with virtually all of the industry standard options being on the table and having done some reading, I'm considering a Vader loaded with some different speakers. The cold quality of the standard Vaders is somewhat unappealing to me, as I'm chasing something with some warmth to go with all of that bottom end tightness; something dead in the middle between the Vader sound and the Mesa w/v30s seems to be what I'm imagining. Has anyone tried the Vader 'Carnage strain' with Manowars in an x-pattern with the custom Vader speakers and have an opinion?

I'm also considering trying other combinations with various Eminence speakers, such as Swamp Thangs and Red White and Blues, which is making the whole thing a little more complicated. My dream tone is basically Erik Rutan's off of 'Conquering the Throne', which I previously thought he recorded with a VH140c (which is my current head), though photos are suggesting he may have been using Marshall even then; but without getting way too sidetracked, if anyone has opinions on the Vaders, I'd be glad to hear them.
Necrovore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2011, 05:03 PM   #2
Claude
Registered User
 
Claude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: montreal
Posts: 1,357
Rep Power: 0 Claude is an unknown quantity at this point
I wouldn't recommend changing out speakers unless you can get decent value for the Legends that already come with the Vader. If you can muster up the cash for that sort of 4x12 setup you might as well change your guitar head as well. Not being judgmental, I just think there's a limit to how much "warmth" you can get out of solid state.

The Carnage Strain is a good option if your criticism of Vader cabs is that they are cold (I agree btw). Another cool option would be an Orange PPC412, but the high powered version; It comes with Celestion K100s instead of V30s. It's a perfect marriage between Vader bottom end and V30 color/comparitive warmth.

...And yes, I've tried it multiple times though I use an old school Mesa Mark III head. Bottomline is I think those options are way better than buying a cab and changing the speakers as far as bang for your buck goes.

EDIT: Another thing to take into consideration is how careful you have to be when crossing different speakers in a 4x12 cab. It can lead to a bunch of phase issues.

Last edited by Claude; 09-01-2011 at 05:06 PM..
Claude is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-01-2011, 07:09 PM   #3
Necrovore
Kyphonism
 
Necrovore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Davis, CA
Posts: 764
Rep Power: 11 Necrovore is on a distinguished road
Thanks for the response, it's super helpful. I am definitely planning on a head upgrade eventually, but given the durability and decent quality of the VH140C, I was figuring on keeping it as a backup and gigging head. My cab, on the other hand, is some replacement-level shit, so the 4x12 is coming first.

The Vader definitely holds major attraction due to construction factors, and that's part of why I had the thought of blending its sound with the Texas Heats, which I thought sounded awesome in the Krankenstein. While I could see just getting the Krank, obviously, it seemed like a Vader with some of that Texas Heat sound was the shit.

Lastly, since I understand the custom eminences in the Vader were designed for modeling, I had the thought of getting a chance to see how they do with the cab models in my Digitech and any future devices.

So really, my current thinking is to start with the Vader (carnage strain), test cab models on it, and go from there. Plan B is to probably try the Krank, and possibly Orange as well, though I've seen some complaints about the latter's construction and features.

As far as the speaker replacement and phase issues, is this related to differences in cone height, minute discrepancies in response, or something else?


Thanks again for the advice, obviously it's a lot of information to sort through. I think once I get a chance to really test some of this stuff, it'll sort itself out a little faster, but I'm definitely looking to get to a pleasing sound sooner rather than later.
Necrovore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-2011, 10:12 AM   #4
Claude
Registered User
 
Claude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: montreal
Posts: 1,357
Rep Power: 0 Claude is an unknown quantity at this point
The same speaker in a different cab will give you a different phase response. Most cabs with different speaker setups in any way/shape/form are engineered so that phase responses are "level", for lack of a better word. That's why I don't necessarily recommend changing out speakers in an already existing cab; Their combined outputs might augment each other at some frequencies, and detract from each other in others.

The only complaint I've ever heard about the Orange cabs is their weight (Their construction is probably some of the best there is) and the fact that they don't use casters (its part of the Orange sound). Counting aside companies like Emperor, Vader, Nomades etc... they are IMO the best manufactured cabs as far as solidity, design, and tone goes.
Claude is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks




Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:40 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SMNnews.com: 2002 -